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My Mother Wants Statues Gone

Post  SpiritofApollo on Thu Apr 11, 2013 7:59 pm

Today something happened that confirmed that while Christians hate being killed and persecuted in Muslim countries they sure like to spread the same treatment to others. I have several statues in my room, one of them is an Artemis statue that I found at Goodwill and I have a four piece Egyptian statue set that I got two days ago and the book by Sharon called 'Circle of the Sun.' Anyway, she had me come down and she told me that she wants them all gone, even the tiny Egyptian statues that aren't harming her.

I mentally took several deep breaths, sent a silent prayer to Artemis, and then said, "Sure, I'll return them." Yeah, right. My mother, who is a Christian, has made it clear that she made an oath to her god that she would follow him. She actually thinks that I need statues to worship the gods. Yeah, right mother. This has gotten to a new low. She respects my space but she doesn't respect my religion.

She says that the statues are idols and she knows nothing about what an idol is. The Ancient Greeks didn't worship a statue of Athena, they worshiped freaking Athena. I love all my statues and I don't want to lose them but I'm being forced up against a wall. The only statues that I can hid are my Egyptian ones. Well time to break out the White Lie Box and bring one out, because there's no way that she's going to take me speaking the truth. Lying is the only thing that she even understands.
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Re: My Mother Wants Statues Gone

Post  Erodius on Thu Apr 11, 2013 8:13 pm

You would be right, in this case, to abide by your mother's requests. If you were in her shoes, I'm sure you would also expect your children to obey you, and you should treat her as such.

From the Pythagorean Pempelus, 'On Parents'
NEITHER DIVINITY nor anyone possessing the least wisdom will ever advise anyone to neglect one's parents. Hence we cannot have any statue or temple which will be considered by divinity as more precious than our parents and grandparents when grown feeble with age. For the one who honors his parents by gifts will be recompensed by the Gods, for without this the divinities will not pay any attention to the prayers of such parents for their children. Our parents' and progenitors' images should by us be considered much more venerable and divine than any inanimate images. For our parents, who are divine images that are animated, when they are continually adorned and worthily honored by us, pray for us, and implore God to bestow on us the most excellent gifts, and do the contrary when we despise them, neither of which occurs with inanimate images. Hence he who behaves worthily towards his parents and progenitors, and other kindred, will possess the most worthy of all statues, and the best calculated to endear him to divinity. Every intelligent person, therefore, should honor and venerate his parents, and should dread their execrations and unfavorable prayers, knowing that many of them take effect.

Nature having disposed the matter thus, the prudent and modest will consider their living aged progenitors a treasure, to the extremity of life; and if they die before the children have arrived there, the latter will be longing for them. Moreover, progenitors will be terrible in the extreme to their depraved or stupid offspring. The profane person who is deaf to these considerations will by all intelligent persons be considered as odious to both Gods and men.


You do not need statues, and any reading you need is available for free online from textual databases like:

http://www.sacred-texts.com/cla/index.htm

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"O Best of Gods, blest daimon crown'd with fire . . . hear, and from punishment my soul absolve, the punishment incurr'd by pristine guilt, thro' Lethe's darkness and terrene desire: and if for long-extended years I'm doom'd in these drear realms Heav'n's exile to remain, O grant me soon the necessary means to gain that good which solitude confers on souls emerging from the bitter waves of fraudful Hyle's black, impetuous flood!"
-Iulianic Hymn to Apollon-Helios, ll. 65-106

"Having come for punishment, one must be punished. One must not pull apart the god within oneself."
-Iamblichus, Vita Pythagorica

"Truth would you teach, or save a sinking land,
All hear, none aid you, and few understand."
-Alexander Pope


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Re: My Mother Wants Statues Gone

Post  SpiritofApollo on Thu Apr 11, 2013 8:59 pm

I guess your right, must be showing that Hellenic spirit. I just wish that she would at least let me have them as decor. When their gone it means that I'll have nothing to decorate my room and my mother can have her statue of a archangel but I can't decorate my room the way that I want. I'm so moving out.
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Re: My Mother Wants Statues Gone

Post  Erodius on Thu Apr 11, 2013 9:20 pm

In my tradition, it is the custom not to use images of Gods for decoration anyway, on the grounds that doing so dilutes one's respect for the images, which are themselves stand-ins for divine numina.

You're going to be fine; you're just upset is all.

It is a Pythagorean precept to delay one's response to any upsetting situation until one's initial kneejerk reaction has cooled off. I have tried to implement this precept more and more in my own life, and those times I have had opportunity to abide by it, I have found it, in the end, to be immensely beneficial to my own sanity and to my and others' feelings.

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"O Best of Gods, blest daimon crown'd with fire . . . hear, and from punishment my soul absolve, the punishment incurr'd by pristine guilt, thro' Lethe's darkness and terrene desire: and if for long-extended years I'm doom'd in these drear realms Heav'n's exile to remain, O grant me soon the necessary means to gain that good which solitude confers on souls emerging from the bitter waves of fraudful Hyle's black, impetuous flood!"
-Iulianic Hymn to Apollon-Helios, ll. 65-106

"Having come for punishment, one must be punished. One must not pull apart the god within oneself."
-Iamblichus, Vita Pythagorica

"Truth would you teach, or save a sinking land,
All hear, none aid you, and few understand."
-Alexander Pope


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Re: My Mother Wants Statues Gone

Post  SpiritofApollo on Thu Apr 11, 2013 9:29 pm

Thanks, for your kind words.
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Re: My Mother Wants Statues Gone

Post  J_Agathokles on Fri Apr 12, 2013 7:01 am

She has a statue of an archangel? Then tell her that's an idol too. Does she wear a crucifix necklace? tell her that's an idol as well. Does she have a Bible? Tell her that's a idol too.

If she's won't get rid of hers, but demands you get rid of yours, then say that is hypocritical.

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Re: My Mother Wants Statues Gone

Post  SpiritofApollo on Fri Apr 12, 2013 3:36 pm

Sounds like a really good idea and fair. If I have to get rid of my stuff then she has to get rid of her stuff. No decorating with horses, none of that stuff. See that's the problem that I have with her. She thinks that I'm going to crawl back to my former faith and be all glad that she's gotten me away from that bad idol worshiping. Personally the whole thing, now, makes me laugh. So this is what I'm going to do. I'll get rid of my statues when she gets rid of everything that her G-d looks down upon, including her archangel.

If I can't have nothing, she can't have nothing. Well except pills, that's different.
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Re: My Mother Wants Statues Gone

Post  Erodius on Fri Apr 12, 2013 3:57 pm

I don't think it will serve you in any way to confront her. She is your mother, and I assume it is her house, and in her house you have to abide by her rules. You cannot give orders or conditions to a parent.

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"O Best of Gods, blest daimon crown'd with fire . . . hear, and from punishment my soul absolve, the punishment incurr'd by pristine guilt, thro' Lethe's darkness and terrene desire: and if for long-extended years I'm doom'd in these drear realms Heav'n's exile to remain, O grant me soon the necessary means to gain that good which solitude confers on souls emerging from the bitter waves of fraudful Hyle's black, impetuous flood!"
-Iulianic Hymn to Apollon-Helios, ll. 65-106

"Having come for punishment, one must be punished. One must not pull apart the god within oneself."
-Iamblichus, Vita Pythagorica

"Truth would you teach, or save a sinking land,
All hear, none aid you, and few understand."
-Alexander Pope


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Re: My Mother Wants Statues Gone

Post  Callisto on Fri Apr 12, 2013 4:22 pm

To be honest, I don't know where the notion that the relationship between parents and children needs to be either "fair" or balanced. Just like Fox News, it's neither. If you're a minor, your parents are responsible for you. That by default means they set parameters they feel are in your best interest. That doesn't mean they're always right, all parents get something wrong. If you're an adult then the onus is on you to get yourself financially stable enough to get your own place, which removes having to live under her restrictions.

I agree with Heron. I know it's difficult and you want to be your own person but you're not at a point in your life in which you're free to do whatever you want, when you want, however you want. That can be a bitter pill to swallow, but that's how it is and in the history of parents and children, that's how it works. Yes your mother can make rules that apply to you that don't necessarily apply to her. This is no different than any other stage in a child's life. Parents drink liquor, smoke, have sex, drive a car, own a gun etc., they don't let their kids do so. Curfews, chores, dress code, social outlets etc. The parents set down the rules, usually motivated by what they believe and hope is in the best interest of their kids, and the kids respond by balking or rebelling. All that does is escalate the situation into unpleasantness for everyone. So you can waste a lot of time and emotion fuming over it, or as they say "suck it up", accept the situation and find a way to move on with things. Learn to deal with it because life will always present obstacles and disappointments. It's ok to whinge, release the emotions but then let it go, pick yourself up and find a way to move on.

I do understand how you feel. My parents had a "fire and brimstone" background. And while they did not subject us to the same, nonetheless their beliefs were staunchly Christian. (Ironically, or perhaps prophetically, whenever my mother was angry at me she'd tell me, "You're a heathen child! A pagan child!" Well as it so happens, mom ... LOL) I found the gods early and did not either reveal or discuss my beliefs with my family. Nor with school mates as I attended parochial schools. Partly I honestly didn't feel the need to nor felt limited since I'd often "be in my own world" (I'd go off on my own) anyway. I don't feel I'm any the worse for it.

The gods are not going anywhere. Do what you can, when you can. It's not like they won't understand. And if imagery is important to you, you'll want to read the discussion here on aniconic representations - you're mother can't object to something if she doesn't know what it represents.

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Re: My Mother Wants Statues Gone

Post  J_Agathokles on Fri Apr 12, 2013 4:35 pm

Perhaps I should have clarified, I wasn't suggested actual disobedience. Just politely pointing it out to her. Emphatically politely.

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Re: My Mother Wants Statues Gone

Post  Andromeda Amethyst on Sun Apr 28, 2013 5:52 am

I've never found pointing out anothers hypocrisy to be useful. It usually just makes them mad (usually becasue they know you are right and can't admit it to themselves). If you really don't want to completely get rid of them is there someone you trust that can keep it safe for you for a while? Hide them under the bed?
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Re: My Mother Wants Statues Gone

Post  SpiritofApollo on Sat May 04, 2013 1:41 am

I've got a friend that has taken them off my hands. My Artemis statue, however, is in a closet and I only bring her out when I'm giving her offerings. It's been a month since she told me to get rid of them and she hasn't mentioned them. Her mind is on other things and I don't bring the subject up. I personally consider the subject about my statues to be over and I'm glad that it is.

I'm too focused right now on studying for my GED and she doesn't bother me when I'm studying.
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Re: My Mother Wants Statues Gone

Post  Andromeda Amethyst on Sat May 04, 2013 3:04 am

Then I would say it is good. No more conflict in the house, at least not over that. If she believes you got rid of them, you are under no obligation to correct her assumption, IMO. Do you're studying and get yourself going in the right direction. Don't kill yourself with the studying. I personally didn't have too much trouble with most of the GED tests, but everyone is different. study Be well and good luck in your future plans.
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Re: My Mother Wants Statues Gone

Post  SpiritofApollo on Mon Jun 24, 2013 4:03 pm

Andromeda Amethyst wrote:Then I would say it is good.  No more conflict in the house, at least not over that.  If she believes you got rid of them, you are under no obligation to correct her assumption, IMO.  Do you're studying and get yourself going in the right direction. Don't kill yourself with the studying.  I personally didn't have too much trouble with most of the GED tests, but everyone is different.    study    Be well and good luck in your future plans.

Trying not to kill myself with studying. I pulled my back last month and it's still hurting me, reminding me that I hurt myself. I still have the statue in my closet and my mother hasn't, once again, mentioned it. I've decided to go outside and give offerings to the gods, since they are everywhere.
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