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Deipnon Celebration

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Deipnon Celebration

Post  Camable on Wed Jul 03, 2013 9:16 pm

I'm aware of the process of leaving a meal of raw eggs, leeks, onions, and fish out for Hekate on the Deipnon. However I'm unsure about what to offer it on and depending on what I offer it on, can that object be retrieved. For instance, plates were used (unless I'm mistaken) to offer the meal and, in some articles I've read, the plate couldn't be used again and in other articles it's left ambiguous. Now, I can leave the offering at the end of my driveway, however, leaving a plate there is sure to attract some "What the hell's?" and also, my house mates may realize missing plates after a while (plus they're not exactly cheap). An alternative I've thought of is to use flour tortillas as a "plate" as they're degradable/animals will eat them. Is this okay? Is it okay to use a plate and then take it back?

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Re: Deipnon Celebration

Post  Erodius on Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:48 pm

I'm aware of the process of leaving a meal of raw eggs, leeks, onions, and fish out for Hekate on the Deipnon.

That's simply a list of things associated with offerings to the Perseia on the Thirtieth of the Attican calendar ( I specify this, because this calendar would only have really applied in the environs of Athens in pre-Imperial times — there is no injunction to leave 'raw eggs, leeks, onions and fish' on the Thirtieth, especially if it would not be practical, reasonable, or meaningful.

However I'm unsure about what to offer it on and depending on what I offer it on, can that object be retrieved.

Such offerings would be made at any of numerous roadside or property-line shrines. They would have some sort of fire altar or brazier for burnt offerings, otherwise, gifts would be left at the site of the shrine, at which there would be some sort of depository for such gifts. It would be of trivial concern what to do with the vessel you carried the oblations in — it wouldn't be necessary to abandon the plate.

Now, I can leave the offering at the end of my driveway, however, leaving a plate there is sure to attract some "What the hell's?" and also, my house mates may realize missing plates after a while (plus they're not exactly cheap). An alternative I've thought of is to use flour tortillas as a "plate" as they're degradable/animals will eat them. Is this okay? Is it okay to use a plate and then take it back?

Relax . . . Wink  My advice is that, unless you have a roadside shrine or herm to go to at which you can deposit your alms, such a practice is not especially relevant/applicable. I, for instance, do not observe the Attican calendar at all — I am not a pre-Imperial Athenian, I live about 7,000 miles away from Attica, and have no particular tie to Athens. The Orphic calendar, for instance, in contrast, is not tied to any particular locale; it is more reflective of calendars of the Hellenistic and Imperial periods (of which our own January, February, March etc. Gregorian calendar is also a derivative). Even to the people of Athens alive at the time of Jesus, for instance, the Classical Athens with which that calendar is associated would have been already ancient history — something four hundred plus years before their time, having been replaced by the Macedonian calendar and Julian calendar, which were, together, the dominant calendars of the Greek and Roman world from the Hellenistic and Roman expansions, respectively. Something to consider.

If you want to make an offering for the eve of the new moon, that is certainly fine. But you needn't (and shouldn't) overstep your means or situation. If you've no ready way of rightfully disposing of food sacrifices, for instance, then you do not have to make such sacrifices. Sacrifices are for the benefit of the sacrificer, not the god. A pinch of incense and a splash of wine is every bit as adequate a sacrifice as any other, such is our teaching on the matter. In other words, I would tell you that a pinch of libanum at a consecrated shrine in your home is greater than a plateful  of spoilable offerings left at the end of a driveway. Wink 

Of course, you can always leave food scraps for the local wildlife — I'm sure they will love you for it — so long as it does not cause issues with drawing pests — which it might, however, especially if the act is habitual.

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"O Best of Gods, blest daimon crown'd with fire . . . hear, and from punishment my soul absolve, the punishment incurr'd by pristine guilt, thro' Lethe's darkness and terrene desire: and if for long-extended years I'm doom'd in these drear realms Heav'n's exile to remain, O grant me soon the necessary means to gain that good which solitude confers on souls emerging from the bitter waves of fraudful Hyle's black, impetuous flood!"
-Iulianic Hymn to Apollon-Helios, ll. 65-106

"Having come for punishment, one must be punished. One must not pull apart the god within oneself."
-Iamblichus, Vita Pythagorica

"Truth would you teach, or save a sinking land,
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Re: Deipnon Celebration

Post  Camable on Thu Jul 04, 2013 12:04 am

Well, the more you know Smile I have some follow up questions. Perseia is the same as Hekate right (that's one of her epithets)? Also libanum is frankincense? Also, I assume a suitable substitute to placing the meal at the end of the driveway would be to offer the meal at the altar, and then dispose of it as I would with other foodstuffs I offer (though I think I prefer the simplicity of the wine and incense offering). Anyway, thank you for your help so far.

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Re: Deipnon Celebration

Post  Erodius on Thu Jul 04, 2013 1:32 am

Yes, Perseia is another name for the goddess often called Ekatē. 'Ekatē' means 'far off/far going/far away', 'Perseia' means 'daughter of Perses'. Other names include 'Einodia', meaning 'on the roadway', and 'Trioditē/Trioditis' meaning 'three roads'.

In Orphism, she is sometimes called Nyktēria 'of the nighttime' referring to her domain over things hidden, and 'Skylakitis' meaning 'of dogs', with which she is associated.


Yes, 'libanum' or 'olibanum' is just another word for frankincense. It's an older, Latin word, derived from the Greek 'libanon'. On a side note, these words are the same root as the name of the country 'Lebanon', from whence the resin was often exported in ancient times.

Also, I assume a suitable substitute to placing the meal at the end of the driveway would be to offer the meal at the altar, and then dispose of it as I would with other foodstuffs I offer (though I think I prefer the simplicity of the wine and incense offering).

Yes, absolutely. Though from my Orpheo-Pythagorean versing, I would favor the second option. As you say, there is a beauty in the clean simplicity. Certain of the Orphic Sages, like the Samian, and Apollonius Tyaneus, taught that only wine and incense were necessary for sacrifice, and, per Apollonius, who took it a step further, the only worthy sacrifices.

Anyway, thank you for your help so far.

It's a pleasure. Smile 

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"O Best of Gods, blest daimon crown'd with fire . . . hear, and from punishment my soul absolve, the punishment incurr'd by pristine guilt, thro' Lethe's darkness and terrene desire: and if for long-extended years I'm doom'd in these drear realms Heav'n's exile to remain, O grant me soon the necessary means to gain that good which solitude confers on souls emerging from the bitter waves of fraudful Hyle's black, impetuous flood!"
-Iulianic Hymn to Apollon-Helios, ll. 65-106

"Having come for punishment, one must be punished. One must not pull apart the god within oneself."
-Iamblichus, Vita Pythagorica

"Truth would you teach, or save a sinking land,
All hear, none aid you, and few understand."
-Alexander Pope


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Re: Deipnon Celebration

Post  Camable on Thu Jul 04, 2013 2:51 am

Again, thank you for your help. I've followed your blog for a while and especially after your help, I must say, you're incredibly intelligent. We're similar in age and you know all this history and etymology and well, I know about the D.C. comics universe Laughing 

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Re: Deipnon Celebration

Post  Erodius on Thu Jul 04, 2013 10:31 am

I'm flattered. But, to be fair, I'm a classicist minoring in religious studies, who formerly was studying linguistics (and remains an amateur linguist). I sort of *have* to be well versed in these things — otherwise, they aren't going to give me my degree.

_________________
"O Best of Gods, blest daimon crown'd with fire . . . hear, and from punishment my soul absolve, the punishment incurr'd by pristine guilt, thro' Lethe's darkness and terrene desire: and if for long-extended years I'm doom'd in these drear realms Heav'n's exile to remain, O grant me soon the necessary means to gain that good which solitude confers on souls emerging from the bitter waves of fraudful Hyle's black, impetuous flood!"
-Iulianic Hymn to Apollon-Helios, ll. 65-106

"Having come for punishment, one must be punished. One must not pull apart the god within oneself."
-Iamblichus, Vita Pythagorica

"Truth would you teach, or save a sinking land,
All hear, none aid you, and few understand."
-Alexander Pope


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Re: Deipnon Celebration

Post  Ελευθερια on Wed Feb 03, 2016 5:16 pm

I personally make my offerings to Hekate inside my home. I do however live at a crossroads but, yes, it would be weird in my neighbourhood if I left food at the corner. Since I read that people would make offering of food at the crossroad in Hekate's name but with the idea of leaving food for hungry travelers, I thought I would also honour Hekate by making a donation to my local food bank. Kind of a modern way of doing the same thing.

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Re: Deipnon Celebration

Post  DavidMcCann on Thu Feb 04, 2016 2:55 pm

I just make offerings of wine, incense, and a hymn to Hekate on the last day of the lunar month. If I put down food at the crossroads, I'd have the local authorities after me for encouraging rats!

I use the lunisolar calendar because I feel this is an important link to the natural world. I doubt that Greek festivals were switched to the Roman calendar. I've never looked for evidence, but I know that Egyptian temples continued to use the lunisolar one. Similarly, Jews, Christians (Easter), and East Asians still use lunar months.

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